Drag Me to the Top

A bustling crowd at Vlada Lounge in Hell’s Kitchen quiets as Cher’s “Dark Lady” begins to play over the loud speakers. The lights dim as the audience takes their seats on orange couches and pleather stools in the upstairs. A theme song begins to play:

“Who is she?

Who is this ravishing sight?

With a fantasy face and staggering smile.”

A spot light illuminates the stage as Paige Turner, one of New York’s prominent drag queens, makes her entrance. The crowd cheers, some shouting “Slurp!” Turner’s unique catchphrase.

Paige Turner

“Supermodel,” one of Turner’s signature opening numbers blasts. Lip-syncing to the song as she removes a pair of white oversized sunglasses from her face and brushes away the bangs from her blond wig, Turner opens a lunch box and furiously chomps down on a carrot. As the lyrics “I didn’t eat yesterday, and I’m not going today, and I’m not going to eat tomorrow, cause I’m going to be a supermodel” play, Turner comically spits the chewed pieces of carrot into the audience, clutching her stomach and looking distressed. The audience roars with laughter as she hits a final pose. Blackout.

In New York, drag queens are masters of the nightlife performance world. Men dressed as women who make a living performing in clubs, many of them are actors who fell into female impersonator roles; others are creative types who found drag as a unique form of self expression. Many have one thing in common: Being a New York City drag queen isn’t enough. They want more. They want fame. They want to be known beyond the bars and clubs of Manhattan. With Logo’s “RuPaul’s Drag Race” television series now on its third season, drag is attracting international attention and breaking out of the constraints of the nightlife world.

Drag first gained national recognition in 1969 when a group of drag queens began a now historic riot outside the Stonewall Inn in New York City’s West Village. Protesting discriminatory police practices, drag queens took to the streets in flamboyant outfits. A year later, Gay Pride Parades began in major cities across the national commemorating the drag queens who fought against homophobia.  These parades still happen today in many cities like Chicago, San Francisco, New York City and Los Angeles, featuring  dozens of wildly decorated floats and hundreds of drag queens dressed in feathers, sequins and enormous wigs. While drag performers are scattered about the country, the drag “scene” is largest in major cities with a thriving nightlife industry where drag queens often establish a community of support for their fellow “sisters” in drag.

Small-town folk might never see a drag queen in real life, but they’ve certainly seen them in movies. Films like “Mrs. Doubtfire” and “The Birdcage” feature men dressed as women, cult films like “Some Like It Hot” and “Priscilla: Queen of the Dessert” showcase comical drag characters. “History stands by drag as something that extends beyond the nightlife scene,” said Rosamund Norbury, photographer and co-author of “Guy to Goddess: An Intimate Look at Drag Queens.” “There is also Jethro’s cousin on the Beverly Hillbillies who he played in drag! And of course Bugs Bunny.” These figures have been a visible in popular culture for decades though often only seen as a point of comedic relief.

“Drag is a performance art but it is always done with a wink,” Norbury said. “With an acknowledgement that the drag queen is actually a man under all the artifice.” And while comedy is a common thread among the drag depictions in mainstream culture, for queens themselves, comedy is only one aspect of their career.

Aside from a reality show like “Drag Race,” drag fame can take many forms. Some drag queens create a brand for their personas, complete with a full line of memorabilia products. Others look to YouTube and other social media platforms to share their talents with the world in hopes of striking Internet gold with a “viral” video. Still others use their unique personas as a platform to start new ventures aside from drag performance.

During her recent Sunday evening show at Vlada, Turner is a bubbly “actress” in a pink tulle baby-doll dress with a sharp wit and a cheap wardrobe; her dress was less than $20 and she jokes that she’ll return it after the show the next day. Originally from Highland Indiana, on stage Turner is a tawdry comedienne: “My goal first and foremost is to always entertain when performing,” she said, but behind the scenes she’s very business-minded, as drag performance is her main source of income.

Aside from being paid for her performances by club and bar owners, Turner bolsters her weekly income by capitalizing on the “Paige Turner” brand. At her performances, the audience members can purchase a variety of Paige Turner souvenirs. “I sell memorabilia so people remember me and also to brand yourself,” she said. Her stockpile of memorabilia ranges from key chains and magnets to autographed, framed 8-by-10 headshots and t-shirts.

At every show Turner polls the audience looking for out-of-towners or first time guests then hawks her wares to new fans. Once they’ve revealed themselves, Turner goes in for the kill. What first appeared to be a friendly get-to-know-you portion of the show was actually a stealthy ploy – she’s a top-notch sales woman.

Her souvenirs aren’t expensive: small items are only $5 and t-shirts are under $20. This tactic has spread Paige Turner souvenirs to multiple continents – from the fridges of European tourists to the key rings of South American visitors. She hopes that this self-promotion might one day lead to bigger and better things. “Ideally I would like to have my own talk show or game show on [television] and have my own stage show produced in Vegas or Broadway,” Turner said confidently, despite the lofty nature of her goals. Turner guest starred in the off Broadway musical “Little House on the Ferry” and regularly performs at weddings and birthday parties all over New York State. While she’s not shy about wanting to break out of the nightlife world, her attempts to achieve fame are modest compared to some other drag queens.

Misty Meaner is four years into her professional drag queen career. Always jealous of the variety of fashion options women had and bored of wearing typical boy clothes even while growing up in Bellport, New York, Meaner dove into the world of drag in New York City. “I felt more comfortable in a dress than in a three piece suit,” Meaner said.

Meaner, 24, is a pretty queen, her long blond hair often accentuated with vibrant eye makeup. Her style is fashion forward, 20-something evening wear; on some nights she might even be mistaken for a club-bound Lindsay Lohan. She’s got a quick tongue, calling out guests who leave during the middle of her show or comically harassing regular audience members who won’t put a dollar in her tip bucket at her weekly show at Vlada.

Like her style, Meaner’s performances are relevant and modern. Many drag queens perform outdated musical numbers from classic Broadway shows or 80’s pop hits, but not Misty Meaner. Her diverse repertoire includes recent Christina Aguilera hits, rare gems from hip-hop’s TLC and even a song by 12-year-old pop star Willow Smith.

While drag is a way for Meaner to express her more beautiful side, fame is always on her mind. “People would ask me what I wanted to be when I grew up I would say a celebrity,” she said. “And in the gay community drag is the easiest way to access that.” While having gained a modest reputation performing at numerous clubs in Manhattan and Brooklyn, being a name in nightlife is just the beginning for Meaner.

Misty Meaner

“Going Viral! with Misty Meaner” began just over a year ago on the first floor at Vlada Lounge. The goal was simple: aside from entertaining the audience, Meaner wanted to create a performance so stunning that once uploaded to YouTube it would “go viral” – or catch attention of YouTubers around the world and become the talk of the social media world. During her show she encourages the audience to film her musical numbers and share them on social media platforms in the hopes that one viral video might set things into motion.

While Meaner has since changed the name of the show to “Drag Team Tag Team” to feature Mocha Lite, another drag performer and Meaner’s out-of-drag partner of five years, “Going Viral!” was a modest success. This spectacle marks Meaner’s longest running weekly show and was also the show that first brought the “Misty Meaner” persona to Hell’s Kitchen, Manhattan’s up-and-coming nightlife epicenter; previously Meaner had only performed in the Lower East Side and Brooklyn bars. She hasn’t gone viral yet but she’s still hopeful. “One of my friends posted a video of me doing my mix of the viral video ‘Britney Spears Stoned’ and it has gotten almost 1,500 views,” she said, somewhat bewildered. “I have no idea how.”

YouTube seemed like the most reasonable step on Meaner’s path to fame. “In today’s day and age the easiest way to become a celebrity is to ‘Go Viral!’ Or go on reality TV,” she said, but reality television is not Meaner’s favorite means of getting famous. She’s the first to vocalize her less-than-positive views on “RuPaul’s Drag Race” and the notion of being a “reality TV star.”

Increased media attention is a significant factor in the escalating popularity of drag. Norbury agrees: “I do believe that drag is becoming less taboo, but I put that down to the Internet and reality TV. There is much more exposure, so it becomes less of a taboo.” And with more exposure, drag queens are more and more hopeful that their dreams of success will become a reality.

Meaner is certain of her goals and confident that this is only the beginning of a career that will continue to grow in the coming years. “I believe I can achieve anything I set my mind to,” Meaner said. “With the amount of success I have gotten in the little time I have been in New York City I can only imagine where I will be in five years.”

Optimism like Meaner’s is a common characteristic in the drag world. Many drag queens are convinced that they will one day become household names whether it’s through viral performances, reality television appearances or even using their drag character as a jumping-off point for another endeavor.

Despite drag’s increased popularity, not all are convinced that fame beyond the nightlife world is feasible. “The essence of a drag queen is really performing in the nightlife scene,” said Leila Rupp, co-author of “Drag Queens at the 801 Cabaret.” While hopes of becoming an international star may be at the forefront of many drag queens’ minds, Rupp’s opinion remains grounded in reality.

“I think it’s pretty hard [to achieve fame],” she said. “The few examples, like RuPaul, probably make it seem more likely to a lot of drag queens.” During her time with the queens depicted in the book, Rupp discovered that the pursuit of drag fame is a difficult and stressful battle. “It takes talent, it takes hard work, and it takes a strong composition,” said Rupp, whose book offers a glimpse into the lives of the drag queens working at the 801 Cabaret in Key West, Florida. Aside from simply being a man dressed as a woman, the nightlife industry is a brutal one. “Drinking, drugs, staying up late, working hard for not very much money takes a toll,” Rupp said. “It takes a strong desire to do [drag].”

But despite her skepticism Rupp is sure of one thing: “There is certainly more visibility lately, and that can be only a good thing,” she said. Some drag queens are already monopolizing on this new wave of attention by branching out into different forms of self-exposure.

Judson Harmon, 20, who uses his own name as the name of his female persona, has been working as a drag queen for more than four years. Getting his start in an Arizona regional theater production of the musical “La Cage aux Folles,” which features male actors dressed in drag, Harmon learned that he could flourish as a female impersonator.

Always having a sense of style, Harmon combined drag performance with a fashionable female persona and gained a reputation in New York City. While many drag queens struggle to make a name for themselves as a “unique” performer in the nightlife world, Harmon has bypassed the club scene by starting his own company that sprung from his drag stylings.

Standing eight feet tall in an eclectic mix of leather, gothic and chained or studded ensembles, Harmon found it difficult to shop for his nightlife wardrobe at already-established retailers. Finding little to his liking – and with the financial assistance of his family – he launched ODD Style, just in time for Fashion Week, in Hell’s Kitchen. Using his recognized name and signature look, Harmon joined forces with other fashionable creatures of the night to launch a company that has the potential to achieve success in beyond the drag world. “I don’t want to achieve fame as solely a drag queen because that’s just one side of me that people see,” said Harmon. “I want to achieve fame as a perfectly bizarre individual showcasing my many different sides.”

Carrying well-known brands as well as up-and-coming designers, ODD Style is a shadowy tribute to the world of street fashion. “It’s a healthy mix of underground and semi-underground fashion,” Harmon said, which is, perhaps not so coincidentally, a near-perfect description of Harmon’s haunting drag person. His arcane sense of style is laid out on ODD Style’s online store: a pair of golden spiked earrings, a set of studded punisher gloves, an immaculately constructed leather and denim cape. The website, http://www.odd-style.com, features pieces generally priced from $120 to  $700, though more affordable accessories range from $20 to $50.

Judson Harmon

Since the fruition of ODD, Harmon’s popularity has dramatically increased, styling photo shoots for New York fashion superstars like “RuPaul’s Drag Race” winner Sharon Needles, along with more nightlife performances, when his schedule allows. “I wasn’t that popular before ODD, but I have found my calling through it,” he said. “I suppose it both attracts people and intimidates them to see that I know exactly what I want to do with my life.” And at such a young age, Harmon has already achieved a level of success that many nightlife performers might never see.

Fame may not be at the forefront of Harmon’s mind, but he’s conscious of the benefits of being well known. “Fame equals success equals money equals the ability to make a positive change in the world,” Harmon said. And while a fashion company wouldn’t immediately seem like a way to change the world, Harmon acknowledges his understated vanity. He is convinced that ODD Style is the only chance he has at making a difference, even if that difference is only changing the way the fashion world views street style. “If you want to make a big change without being famous, join the American Red Cross. But personally, field work is not a flattering look on me,” he said with a laugh.

Though his popularity is still growing, Harmon believes that this is just the beginning. “We get hits on the site from Estonia!” he said. “I forgot that country even existed until I received an order from there.” Putting drag on the backburner but keeping his drag principles of individuality and shock-value in mind, Harmon has created a brand this is creeping toward international recognition.

If drag continues to garner mainstream recognition, however, some are concerned that the art will lose the glamour that it once possessed. “I find, these days, that the tendency is more towards ‘passing’ rather than going to extremes,” Norbury said of the less flamboyant and striking appearances of drag queens today. “In my recent experience there is less over-the-top mimicking.” The “fantastic drag” that was supported by annual events like “Wigstock,” created by drag icon Lady Bunny, is being replaced with more realistic interpretations of female now edging away from taboo. Norbury believes that drag might be losing some of its flavor in exchange for a place in the mainstream spotlight.

Regardless of the changes that may take place in the drag world, drag queens continue to step up their game, searching for the big break that will take their careers to the next level. Fame may be fleeting, but history has shown that drag is not. “There will always be drag,” Norbury said.


Club Kid vs Drag Queen, an Inner-Battle: The Theo Whelson Story

This week I sat down with Theodor Whelson, a club kid du jour and token member of Gerry Visco’s “Gerry and the Twinks.” While he’s a regular in Brooklyn, Hell’s Kitchen, and Downtown Manhattan clubs, he made his drag debut just last week at the new Brooklyn drag competition “Dragnet.”
I got the T from Theo about nightlife, drag and the inner battle between a half club kid half drag queen gay boy.

Theo Whelson, aka "The Idiot" dove into the world of drag for the first time last week.
- Photo courtesy of Gerry Visco

C: Hi Theo, or do you prefer Theodor?
T: Theo’s good.

C: It’s getting late, are you planning on going out tonight?
T: Nope! I like to have at least two weeks to prepare before going out anywhere.

C: But you’re fairly well-known in the nightlife circuit right?
T: I think well-known is a stretch. I’m lucky to be associated with the world-famous Gerry Visco. I ride in her wake.

C: But you have a nightlife alter ego right? “The Idiot?”
T: Yes I guess you could say that! The Idiot is a performance name I use for music, but I’m only beginning to work up the guts to introduce myself that way. So, yes The Idiot is the first nightlife alter ego.
And the second was just born this week. Her name is Hamm Samwich and she’s a chick.
I haven’t decided how many “M’s” should be in the name. It’s all very nascent

C: Oh so you’re a drag queen these days? How did that come about?
T: My buddy Nick Feder, aka DJ Nicky Fader, was asked to DJ at a new drag night in Brooklyn called “Dragnet” and there were looking for people to inaugurate their competition so he asked me!
I’d been thinking about doing a drag character for a while, but I hadn’t taken action.

C: Well you’ve never shied away from wearing women’s clothing when you go out to parties. Is drag a natural progression from androgyny?
T: Absolutely, absolutely. It was a big step in the progression.

C: So I want to know. Are you going to keep doing drag after you popped your cherry last week?
T: The answer is yes! The experience absolutely changed my life and I’ve been kind of freaking out for the past couple of days.

C: What was so life changing?
T: Something clicked into place when I put everything on, I can barely explain it, and nothing I had ever done really prepared me for it.
I think I’ve always wanted to be “pretty.” It’s created a lot of anxiety because I think I’m not very naturally female looking in daily life – kind of beastly.

C: And drag allows you to be pretty?
T: More that just allowing me to be pretty, it allows me to be friendly, and flirtatious, and all of that trite shit. Because its such a bold statement: You’re not asking anyone to think you’re hot, you have to believe you’re hot.

C: So is Hamm an extension of Theo?
T: Well Hamm is a tranny rapper. She raps about her p*ssy, that’s her deal.
I’m not exactly sure how much of me is in there, but there is a definite continuity between me and that b*tch. Like, she is not glamorous.

C: So describe Hamm. Was she a character you’d been thinking about, or did you come up with her after being asked to do the show?
T: I had been thinking about it for a long time! My solution to the whole drag “problem” was always going to be rap.
I cannot lip-sync at all. I also can’t dance very well. But surprisingly I can come up with some good rhymes.

C: So why not just be “The Idiot?”
T: Haha. I haven’t quite figure this out.

C: Is Hamm a threat to “The Idiot?”
T: Absolutely. I can already feel her eating “The Idiot” up for dinner.

C: Is this a Nicki/Barbie/Roman complex?
T: Haha. I’m not familiar.
Hamm maintains a studied ignorance of Nicki MInaj. She’s all about the Wu-Tang.

C: Is Theo as well?
T: Insofar as a total noob gay guy can be. I have so much respect for Wu-tang. Which I can’t really say I have for Minaj.

T: Listen let’s be honest. Her beats are f*cking lame as sh*t and she rhymes the same words with the same words.
C: Those are fighting words in the gay community.

C: Who is saying this? Hamm or Theo?
T: I have to plead the fifth. I could turn this into a hugely lopsided rap feud, but I think Hamm is all about love. Wait. That’s a flat-out fabrication.
I’ll say as Theo that I think that lady should’ve been kicked out of bed the second she rhymed “polanksi” with “zolanski.”
Hamm has no comment.

C: Our readers might not get that reference, but we’ll let them do a little research.
T: Okay! See the thing with Hamm Samwich is that I want her to be a legitimate rapper.

C: So when can we expect to see Hamm next?
T: I don’t know, Christopher! I’ll probably just have to start taking her out on the town.
I know exactly where all of my money is going from this point forward: wigs, makeup, clothes, duct tape. I can take the money out of my food budget. No more food for Theo.

C: So you’re both going to shed a few pounds for the sake of beauty?
T: Losing weight for my sake is nowhere near as compelling as losing it for hers. I want the best for her. It’s like having a child.
There’s a real sense of it being a noble effort, as if it were on behalf of another person.
Once this pink haired b*tch walked into my life I was like, “You need to learn some new skills!”

Whelson as his female persona, Hamm Samwich who hates Nicki Minaj.
- Photo courtesy of Donavon Lowe

C: So you think she’s taking you to the next level, as a whole?
T: Absolutely. That’s the source of this weird feeling I’ve been having the past week.

C: Well, I’d venture to say that that weird feeling will give way to a good one shortly.
T: You would know, girl.

C: Oh would I?
T: Well you’ve had your own blossoming thing. I mean you don’t do drag, but you found a look that was so specific. And it’s definitely got some of the cross-dress empowerment.

C: Well yes but that’s quite a different story.
T: But the idea that I literally don’t have to… well I’m still getting over how great that is.

C: I’m very excited to see how Hamm develops in the coming months.
T: Well thank you so much.

C: Will you keep us posted of her accomplishments?
T: Of course! This was delightful.

C: Thank you Mr. Whelson, Ms. Samwich. We look forward to hearing from you soon.
T: Thanks, baby girl!

Don’t Be a Cynthia Face

Krystal Something-Something wants to be on RuPaul’s Drag Race Season 5. 

Her style is over the top. One eye is black, one eye is white. Her makeup is wild and fanciful. She’s Krystal Something-Something and she’s a queen of a different color.

Kyrstal Something-Something known for her unique and creative avant-garde style.

Krystal: I want to be on Drag Race mostly because I want to bring my kind of art to a larger audience. I want people to see that there is so much more to “drag” than the typical fishy looks and pop songs. There have been amazing artists and performers on the show that have started to open the door to crazier and freakier things, and I want to get on there and bust that door down!

You can vote for Krystal Something-Something here.

My Secret Life as Liza

Many drag queens develop their own, unique personalities complete with specific voices, catch phrases and appearances. But some make their living as impersonating real life women.

James Mills is an actor based in New York City. At night, he can frequently be found having a cocktail or watching a drag performance in Hell’s Kitchen where he lives in a studio apartment. But Mills has a secret talent. Despite spending most of his evenings in casual attire, Mills sometimes dons a costume and appears as Liza Minnelli or Carol Channing, two beloved Broadway stars.

It began during his first musical when he was 17. A fellow cast member noted that his the vibrato in his voice resembled Lisa Minnelli and suggested he play her in drag. Mills, who had no formal theatrical training at the time hesitantly entered a New Mexico drag competition called Come Out, Come Out! and performed “Liza One-Note” from the Broadway spoof-musical Forbidden Broadway. “It was a hit!” Mills said. “After that, I started doing appearances as her for other drag shows.”

James Mills as Liza Minnelli, with drag queen Paige Turner.

Eventually his impersonation repertoire grew to include Carol Channing. Pulling out a perfectly pressed red pant suit, a long pearl necklace and a pair of owl eye glasses, Mills transforms into the bubbly and aloof Ms. Channing. Like Liza, the Carol persona has hosted events at clubs in New York City and made guest appearances during drag shows. And while he’s not trying to make a living as a female impersonator he’s garnered an impressive reputation for his talent. “James emobodies Carol Channing with such joy and a bit of poking fun at this legend that everyone seems to gravitate towards,” said friend and drag queen Paige Turner. “His impersonation is spot on!”

Mills sees his Liza and Carol impressions as characters he can pull out of the closet, just their their ensembles. His admiration for the two stars is perhaps what brings him such joy playing them. “These ladies are born out of my love for them. And my ear for silly character voices,” Mills said.

James Mills as Carol Channing.

When Mills arrives in character the mood in the room is electric. His impersonations are spectacular and vibrant, and always a surprise to see.

How to be a Drag Queen: YouTube Edition

Have you ever looked at a drag queen’s Facebook profile? If you start from their earliest photos and go forward, eventually ending up looking at more recent pictures, you’ll see a huge transformation.
No one is perfect, as we all know. And makeup – moreover drag makeup – is truly an art unto itself. As queens begin their journey into the world a drag they pick up tricks of the trade from various sources. Many drag queens have “drag mothers,” more experienced queens that help newbies learn the ropes, who offer tips to improve their drag. But YouTube has quite certainly become the most invaluable source for makeup tutorials.

Teaching drag queens to be better drag queens is not only an opportunity to assist drag culture, but an opportunity to gain a following via the internet.
There are hundreds of makeup and drag tutorials ranging from amateur queens like Genderbender2010’s “Boy to Girl Full Body Transformation” video to more well-known tutorial guru’s like CMAddoxBiitch’s Lace Front Wig How-To.

Drag queen Misty Maven has made a name for herslef with extensive drag tutorials – from how to “tuck” to how to keep your wig on straight. She says in a description on her YouTube channel “There are 43809434 ways to do a drag” and with over 250 tutorial videos under her belt already, Maven is well on her way to showing viewers each and every one of them. Her dedication to makeup tutorials, and her growing fan base, has earned her a YouTube badge of honor as the “#40 Most Subscribed Guru of All Time.”

MIsty Maven, a YouTube makeup guru.

So What is Drag?

Becoming a drag superstar may be on the minds of many drag queens, but educating the world about drag culture is crucial before any queen can go beyond the limits of gay culture. So lets define the term “drag queen.”

Most simply, a drag queen is a man dressed in the appearance of a woman who often performs musical routines for the entertainment of their audience. Female impersonators, if you will. The extent to which these characteristics apply to each drag queen varies. Most drag queens wear wigs, some do not. Queens that bring more masculine traits to their personas are sometimes referred to as “hybrid” drag queens. A term coined by original hybrid queen Acid Betty, seen below:


Acid Betty, a New York drag queen who coined the term "hybrid" drag.
Photo via the Village Voice.

While most drag queens lip-sync to popular songs, some also sing live at their shows. To be a successful drag queen one must possess the “charisma, uniqueness, nerve, and talent” as RuPaul, perhaps the most successful and well-known drag queens in the world, would say. RuPaul, who first entered the New York nightlife scene in the 90’s around the age of the Club Kids, now hosts “RuPaul’s Drag Race” on Logo. RuPaul seen below:

RuPaul, photo via avclub.com.

To clarify, most drag queens are not transgender, meaning as men they do not wish that they were women. They wear women’s clothing to entertain and perform, and are predominately homosexual.

At its heart, drag is a form of artistic expression. Some drag queens use their own body as a blank canvas to create the image of an entirely different being.  Using makeup they reconstruct the shape of their face: adding high cheek bones, perfectly shaped eyebrows, luscious lips.

Many drag queens are trained actors that fell into the drag world by mistake, but successful drag queens can make enough money to support themselves without other work. Especially when they branch out to other industries, using their name as a label, to record albums, design clothing, and in RuPaul’s case, having your own television show.

Drag is more than just a show, it is a culture. In the documentary “Paris is Burning” the viewer is given an insight into the lifestyle of drag, that reaches beyond a nightclub stage. Drag has its own set of slang and underlying social rules. Like any subculture there is a hierarchy of power, do’s and don’t’s, and standards and expectations amongst the group.

Hopefully this gives some clarification for those who might be confused.